Originally by: Astasia Orian

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A bunch of people (Hi Goonies) emo-declaring the "END OF EVE AAAAAAAA" is cute when most of them have only been around 5 months and were attracted to it for the very reason that it's full of anarchic sillyness.
On a t20 scale of scandalness this is about a 0.00001. Credit for being able to make dramamountains out of molehills though!

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Originally by: ghosttr

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Well it was handled incorrectly by both sides.

On Non-Anwsered Petitions

If CCP didn't respond to the petitions made (if any were made), then CCP was wrong. CCP should have acknowledged the petition, and handled any issues in a private matter. Petitions are the only way the playerbase has to resolve issues, if the petition system doesn't work, then the response is a non-public response by the player. After the issue went public then CCP was right for not answering petitions. (due to the bias of the original poster).


On a dev joining the corporation.

I don't think this is a real issue, devs should be able to move about freely to fix problems. The only problem i see here is that devs should have better tools so that they don't have to join a corporation to fix issues, or that there is no log that the dev joined or left the corp.


On any player claiming to know a developer.

Any player claiming to know a dev, or any player who impersonates a dev should be punished according to the eula. If a corp member in bob claimed to be able to know a dev, impersonated a dev, or anything similar to that.

That player should be banned if there is any evidence of this, any action taken that even suggests that any CCP staff may be involved should also be investigated. (like if a bob member claims that ccp is going to ban someone, if they do get banned, such action should be looked into)

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Quote:

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Originally by: hybridundertakerlol a guy posts a nice write up with only 2 jpegs as proofs and the forums get crashed.

1st i dont trust that guy, whoever he claims to be (why came out of closet now, with so many projects and games why even care?)

2nd i dont give a **** if a ccp member enters my corp to test if the bug has been removed or whatevah

3rd bob guys in local vanting about how they can get ccp to do stuff for them is more like a joke (did u notice they name their ship DEVS, u forgot to mention that hard proof) then any proof at all

4th can i have your stuff guys?YARRRR!!

5th WTB cheap high sp chars!ugh

6th LOOsers bitter very much? LaughingLaughingLaughing

7th forums deteriorate evn more (i never thought that would be possible) with goons posting, can they pls go back to their own forums... pls...



You just possibly can't understand how this isn't just the "goonies" problems can you? Your pubbie hatred of us doesn't let you see a major problem that affects you just as much as it does us. You don't understand because you are a pinhead who lacks the ability to critically engage anything that doesnt include ******** forum smileys.Twisted EvilTwisted EvilTwisted Evil

Just wait till you are affected by corruption. Just wait till you send the petitions and make the threads only to have them ignored and deleted. Then come back to this thread and make the first informed post of your internet life.

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Originally by: Rebellion

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The goon rage for the sake of righteousness would be believable if you showed equal outrage at your leadership making real money profit from your time cards. Or at the real world angle to the gaming activities of the people you ally yourselves with.

Why am I not surprised that SA goons have also started spamming sladhdot and digg too? If you're really interested in the truth, you'd wait for CCP to post their side before spamming this all over the place. You would even be able to wait until CCP says something that you supposedly have "proof" otherwise, and make them look all the more like liars. But no, it's much better to raise hell and get as much attention as you can, and keep spamming the allegations for the off chance that people that read take it at face value, you'd even create these people if you had to, if only to make it appear that 3rd party individuals actually do believe something wrong is going on.

If you really hated how CCP run EVE for legitimate reasons, you'd just quit and stop paying them. But no, you have a real axe to grind, and want to take the game down. It's not enough that you stop paying CCP for their game, you want other people to stop paying too, so that CCP gets hurt more.

Would you get geek cred by being able to claim that you pwned EVE? Most of you play this game because of a desire to ridicule the stereotype of the playerbase, just like what you did with Second Life.

At this point, I don't know of CCP even thinks it's worth putting up with goon antics just for their monthly subscriptions. Perhaps goons anticipate that too, and thus want to make their monthy subscription worth more in that they would seek to influence other players to make their pressure group weigh more in the eyes of CCP.

At any rate, when you do leave EVE, I hope it would be after your fleets learn to focus fire on primaries. It requires the same discipline as copying and pasting the same text all over the forums.

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Originally by: Dianabolic

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Originally by: Midgath Stallsman

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Originally by: Dianabolic

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tbf guys, if you're all so offended by the fact that we've built up a relationship with the makers of this game over FOUR YEARS of playing it, perhaps you should start acting your age and, instead of looking to sacrifice them for your own gains at every opportunity, engage with them to make this game what we all want it to be?

That's all we want it to be, regardless of what you think of us or how we or CCP go about it, but instead you go in to "threadnaught" mode.

It might be something for you all to consider.

Or, you can all continue crying like *****es.

Your choice, right?

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Nothing wrong with being friends. It is when your able to get people fired because they may or may not have bumped one of your dreads that it becomes an issue.

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As I've said, I completely agree. No sensible person can argue any different, wouldn't you agree?

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Originally by: Mahmoud Ahmadinejad

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Originally by: squidgee

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Edited by: squidgee on 26/05/2007 03:20:35

Originally by: Mahmoud Ahmadinejad

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That is how eve works, get over it.

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This is the problem with BoB. Right here.

Cheating? That's how EVE works.
MSN contact with devs? That's how EVE works.
Devs spying for you? That's how eve works.

Bend over and take it, because apparently corruption and cheating are just how eve works.

And before you try to deny you're bob again:

Originally by: Mahmoud Ahmadinejad

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Bob is just doing what any normel humans would do. Because we are normal human beings who just enjoy eve, unlike you t1 goonies who just want to ruin it.

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Nice typo.

Colluding with Devs and GMs isn't "being normal human beings," it's cheating.

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I'm not bob, I just made a typo

besidies, you need to stfu until your alliance can actually hold your space

Bob has just tried to be friendly to the people who made this game nad you're trying to destroy it. if you really liked eve you'd shut up and get in touch with eve before whining on the forums. Your alliance is already ruining hte game with spies and lag exploits and crapping up 0.0 with your noobs who don't deserve to be there, you don't need to do any more to hurt the game.

All of you goonies need to stop posting and hyurting eve.

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Originally by: Shivalla

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Originally by: Stahlregen

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Originally by: Viktor Bout

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Goons go and play POTBS. In POTBS you have a Dev whos a member of SA/Goons. You are searching for an excuse to leave eve coz you ruined nearly every mmporg youve joined exept eve. You assimilated nearly every corp in your area and you still cant win this game. You cant win by blobbing and you cant win by leaving drama bombs. Zerg away...

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NO DAMNNIT!

We're going to ruin this game if it's the last thing we do!

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Hmmm... And now I can see it all clearly.

You are RUINING THE GAME for us all. Stop. Please.

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Originally by: AngryCanuk

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Someone suggested this in another forum....and the more i Think about it, the more I like the idea...

Format the database, and start everything over. Who knows how much corruption has allowed for this game to be skewed in favor of certain people.....

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Originally by: Khorian

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There is something wrong. CCP needs to control their Dev/GM commands better. The new IA seems to work as crime prevention and also they will now investigate this case. what I can see this case is not about BoB.

It's about a GM who handled his job poorly. He should have done it invisible to the players. Or he should have informed the Ceo if the corp. We don't know what he did so we can not argue about that. Logical thinking leads me to belive that it was nothing harmful and infact just his job, because he was visible to the Ceo. That is all about that part of the open letter.

ISD Events.... well. I have never been in one, but I would guess CCPs story department sets a rough outline for the events, concerning the outcome. So they can move the story in the direction they want it to go.

BoB members have MSN contact to CCP, so they say. Maybe some do, maybe they don't. I know as much as you about this (nothing). My last petition took 5 days to be handled, but it was handled in a good professional way. CCP CS is very good compared to other games btw.
Who knows what other Alliances have contact to ex-players in CCP? We don't know and probably will never know. BoB is definately not the only alliance from which players became CCP volunteers / employes.

I agree that CCP needs to monitor Dev/GM commands better. From what I can see it seems to work lately. This "affair" seems to consist mostly of hot air. There are some accusations, but no real proof.

Avon is right when he says there are certain procedures to follow when dealing with crimes in game as in real life. Else we would live in anarchy and mayhem and drumhead court-martial. Like in the Middle Ages when they burned poor women and men as witches for shady reasons.

Please, please wait what comes out of this. CCP will investigate and inform us about what happened. Then make your decisions about leaving or staying. If this game is no fun to you there really is no point in playing.

Lastly I would like to point out that I am a lowly BoB grunt, since often people mistake the postings of BoB members as the general opinion of BoB as a whole. I want a cheat free game just as the next guy.

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Originally by: Apple Boy

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This thread is so


can any dev post a a brief summery at the beginning with some Q&A for those that don't have time to read 69 pages of text?

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Originally by: HankMurphy

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Originally by: eleuthereus

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Originally by: HankMurphy

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The series of events that led up never needed to occur, but its not like they logged on and deleted someones fleet... the guy just picked a bass ackwards way of fixing something.

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He did? That's all that happened? He just "picked a bass ackwards way of fixing something." Where did you read this in an offical response from CCP? Or, did Darkstar 1 just recieve some notification from CCP this is what Sharkbait was officially doing and he simply forgot top tell someone he was doing it? I was under the imporession as of 17:30 GMT that no offcial reply had been made by CCP and that Darkstar 1 had still not received an answer as to why Sharkbait had infiltrated the corp. Thanks in advance for supplying us with your information and its source. If you were referring to something else, please specify.

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Nice, you found one sentence in all my postings you can actually reply to. Well done

I talk from what i see. Do you see anything malicious? What was he doing? 'Fixing' the entire war from that pos so you can never win right? lol, Fact is you have no idea! Neither one of us do.

But that does not stop you and yours from doing everything to blow it completely out of preportion. Nope, goons dont care what they know. They dont care about facts or any of it. They want to see heads roll, they want to see 404 messages from crashing websites... because when their down on their luck and losing, they will make sure NO ONE had a good time....

ask yourself, why? Why do it?
....er, i should say, why do you blindly follow the ppl that do it?

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Originally by: Shivalla

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Originally by: Jonas Vance

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Originally by: Shivalla

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Originally by: Stahlregen

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Originally by: Viktor Bout

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Goons go and play POTBS. In POTBS you have a Dev whos a member of SA/Goons. You are searching for an excuse to leave eve coz you ruined nearly every mmporg youve joined exept eve. You assimilated nearly every corp in your area and you still cant win this game. You cant win by blobbing and you cant win by leaving drama bombs. Zerg away...

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NO DAMNNIT!

We're going to ruin this game if it's the last thing we do!

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Hmmm... And now I can see it all clearly.

You are RUINING THE GAME for us all. Stop. Please.

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And by "Us all" you mean BoD. Cry more pleaze. Your tears make me laugh.

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By us all, I mean the whole EVE-ONLINE community of players.

As it has been said many times b4, these un-constructive trolls and flames, are only making this thread, and for example CAOD in sense utterly disappointing. And in general the WHOLE COMMUNITY feels sick and tired of people who aims to break the community.

You sir, aint helping.

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Originally by: Tholarim

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Originally by: NereSky

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What ever proof is shown you and your Band of whatevers will deny it, if this gets swept under the carpet again , you lot won't be able to help yourself and yet again you will

while there's still people like you in eve, i still have a purpose, and that is to kill your alliances. I'd say bob is the one of the few with honour in this game, since we don't blame any1 else wheen we lose. That's the difference. You on the other hand would grasp any straw provided to you.

I won't try and reason with any of you anymore, since it won't help in the slightest. Come try and take us down ingame, where this **** belongs.

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behave in a manner to bring more shame

i would say 'just leave' and salvage some honour from this debacle' but you wont you will keep denying it try to misdirect and attempt to get away with it until all what will be left is a game developers alliance playing with yourselves.

where can you hide you heads in shame now?
back in the sand or CCP HQ?

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Originally by: maria stallion

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Edited by: maria stallion on 26/05/2007 20:24:35
Is this thread really neccesary to start the great eve war part 2?
you guys can just fight us without a stupid reason you know :)

anywayz I hope this will end up in a group of 20k people trying to kill us once again,
I could use a bit more action :)

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Originally by: D'Artagnan

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"Dianabolic admitted in this thread that you have inappropriate connections with CCP that others don't. Who to believe, if not your chief diplomat?"

As i said earlier other alliances have the same connection, i used to have one when i was anti bob but none in my corp at the time knew about it. I beg you not to be as stupid as you are acting at the moment.

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Originally by: D'Artagnan

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Originally by: Jonas Vance

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Originally by: D'Artagnan

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"Dianabolic admitted in this thread that you have inappropriate connections with CCP that others don't. Who to believe, if not your chief diplomat?"

As i said earlier other alliances have the same connection, i used to have one when i was anti bob but none in my corp at the time knew about it. I beg you not to be as stupid as you are acting at the moment.

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Proof or stfu. Which alliances have GM connections. If one of the largest alliances in the game doesn't have them then I think you're full of it. Oh and make sure you get them to admit it.

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Hey read my previous posts and you will know i used to have them when i was in KIA, at the time i knew of people in the PA and G that had similar contact, but as i said i dont have that contact anymore but i am sure people do as its part of the game.

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Originally by: Avon

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I don't think road construction workers should be banned from driving on the roads they repair, and I would be uncomfortable flying on a plane that the makers will not use.

There isn't always a conflict of interest, sometimes it is in the customers interest that those who provide a service for a living would also be happy to use that service.

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Originally by: WhitePhantom

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Originally by: Jonas Vance

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Originally by: Avon

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I don't think road construction workers should be banned from driving on the roads they repair, and I would be uncomfortable flying on a plane that the makers will not use.

There isn't always a conflict of interest, sometimes it is in the customers interest that those who provide a service for a living would also be happy to use that service.

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No offense, but I don't think this is a good example. Road workers driving on the road they work on does not help them improve the road. Nor do plane designers make a plane better from flying in it. Heck, some airline engineers may even be afraid to fly.

Since GM's "Police" the game, it would be more like the police pulling over some people, but not other's because they are good friends with them. In addition the police would be telling these people how to speed and get away with it, or what to say when pulled over.

This happens in real life although I don't believe it should. In terms of game development, it is impossible for a dev to be completely unbiased/non-partial when playing an in-game entity that has to deal with in-game politics. Reguardless of whether they would or would not abuse the ability, the fact that the opportunity is there is more than enough to make me uncomfortable.

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I am sure its possible because I would hope the developers of other games, are able to play the game, in order to balance said game. Granted Eve is sort of different, but thats besides the point, to claim its not possible is just wrong.

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Originally by: Astarte Nosferatu

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Edited by: Astarte Nosferatu on 28/05/2007 01:47:09
Exactly because there is no proof Dev's are giving away valuable EvE intel through MSN is enough reason why they should not be talking to paying customers on MSN. For all we know BoB might have gotten loads of advice from CCP other paying customers didn't have access to, and CCP wouldn't be able to be held accountable as there would be no way to prove it.

If they aren't guilty, they should have known better. It's their own fault.

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Originally by: Cheng

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If the dev/gm's reveals something about the game, then it's the dev/gm's fault. Not the person that got to know the information.

You need to start widening your perspective, nobody in BoB (except from t20) has cheated. NOBODY afik.
We have been branded cheaters just because of one mans act.

Like I said before, grow up.

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Originally by: Cheng

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Can you show me proofs of someone else that is in BoB or was in BoB, cheated?

I'm asking for proofs... Not speculations. If you can't give me hard proofs, then don't bother answering. It will only make you look bad.

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Originally by: Cheng

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What about t20? - We know he cheated, I asked from PROOFS that SOMONE ELSE cheated.

Don't spin around what I have previously stated. I don't care if a dev/gm tells his friend that he is one. I just don't care.

What I care about is that people are stating bull**** about BoB and it's players.

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Originally by: Cheng

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Innocent until found guilty. - The investigation has revealed that CCP SharkB. was infact doing his job. There was a petition even though Darkstar1 lied there was none. And the petition was not deleted. - So I wonder what else is false in that "Open Letter" ?

I could also say there are no proofs that the Goons. have not cheated Or any other for that matter :P

Kugutsumen is a jerk, nuff said.

The example about "Ishos Rerajan" is valid but it's the devs fault, not BoB :) - So hang the dev.
But, the dev has a choice not to use his devpowers to give his alliance the advantage. And until the dev starts cheating then i con't care if he's a dev. ;)

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Originally by: Popsikle

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Hmm, talking to your friends over MSN, or hell talking to your faimly over MSN is an advantage? Nobody ever said that they were talking abotu game breaking stuff, so you came to the conclusion on your own that because they were talking that it makes a difference. Whos to say they werent talking about the weather, or some fine ass girl/guy they saw?

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Originally by: Sergeant Spot

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Interesting what is known to be true at this point.

We know for a fact that Darkstar1 lied.
We know for a fact that a pro-goon ISD was bumping bob dreads out of alignment.
We know that bob rushed a petition to have CCP "look" at the issue.

Somehow I dont feel very bad.

Guess what folks, dont expect this to be the end of this crap. So long as some folks (goons and other bob haters) are witch hunting for some excuse they can twist for scandle value, they WILL find stuff now and then. Not even perfect saint behavior can stop a determined inspector from finding something to complain about, and that applies to a heck of a lot more than Eve.

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Originally by: Cheng

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As I've stated before, I don't care if someone has a dev/gm friend on his contact list. They are friends. Do you know what that is?

And plus, how is it a advantige that he has some dev on his msn list? - I'd say it's a advantige to have someone who trusts you enough to even tell you that he is a dev.

This is not proof of any ingame cheating.

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Originally by: Malloc Memrel

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By way of anecdote since I ran out of room last post, we used to joke about an associate of mine at Blizzard having "Magic Dice". As is common in large dungeon crawls, the best loot would be "rolled" for by asking the system's random number generator for a number between one and a hundred, with the highest roller being allowed to take the most coveted items. This employee would almost always win the rolls. It didn't matter if the next highest roll was nine or ninety, he'd win it most of the time.

When he played on the public servers, his guildmates gave him good-natured grief about it- "Argh, you lucky son of a~!"- but they just chalked it up to him being really lucky, as some people simply are.

Think, for a second, what their reaction would be if they knew he was a developer? Would it be so easy to pass his consistent good fortune off with the knowledge that he knows the people who designed the random number generator? Would it be impossible to concieve that he knew, somehow, how to fix the dice? Even if it was the farthest thing from the truth, there'd be the suspicion, and it wouldn't be unreasonable, which is why he's never told anyone outside the company anything about his character, his guild, anything, ever. His guildmates have no reason to suspect him because they have no idea they're playing with a Blizzard employee. Nobody ever has any idea that they're playing with Blizzard employees, not even to each other. I've heard of Blizzard people who went to guild meets incognito and discovered that their co-workers have been right there in their guild with them for months and months without even realizing it, so total was the secrecy.

I think EVE as a whole needs a new set of blinders put on it, one that obscures all vision between the customer side of the line and the corporate side of the line. Mixing the two is a pandora's box that has, is, and will inevitably lead to more public outcries over accusations of impropriety which ultimately hurt the company as a whole. I don't know how things are in Europe, but stateside the video game industry is one big incestuous family where everybody knows everybody else. How many times will "EVE Scandal!" have to appear on the front page of Slashdot before the company becomes a Resume' Stain? We're at twice, and that's pushing it already.

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